And now for something completely different...

[drago]

No I think only once someone had influence on him at all

 

[destrution]

couldn't I make only once a mistake without making me lough^^

I no my English is not the best

you have to forgive me or ... ehm ... ok I say nothing else, just let me my mistakes

 

[Chemiker]

couldn't I make only once a mistake without making me lough^^

I no my English is not the best

you have to forgive me or ... ehm ... ok I say nothing else, just let me my mistakes

It's more the combination with your dyslexia what makes it quite amusing.

My life is influence free - I hate those buggers, hrhr.

 

[drago]

Don't worry, destrution, if you are able to learn one or two things from this thread you already are on the right way. It is one goal of the thread to help with the language. And as long as we understand you it's ok.

But one thing is obvious: you try too much to build a sentence in german and translate it. Consider building the whole thing in english right from the start. After some time this will get very simple and if you do too much of it you may even dream in english.

But that's ok. The only problem is the subtitles in dutch

.

 

[Maschenka]

But one thing is obvious: you try too much to build a sentence in german and translate it. Consider building the whole thing in english right from the start. After some time this will get very simple and if you do too much of it you may even dream in english.

But that's ok. The only problem is the subtitles in dutch

I actually had MacGyver once talk Russian to me in a dream.

 

[destrution]

But one thing is obvious: you try too much to build a sentence in german and translate it. Consider building the whole thing in english right from the start. After some time this will get very simple and if you do too much of it you may even dream in english.

But that's ok. The only problem is the subtitles in dutch

.

hm I've nerver learned it in an other way^^
my biggest problem is, that I sometimes really want to try it right. Then I'm thinking about what I'm writing...
but in the most cases my English is really better if I do it spontanously^^
I don't know why, but every time I'm thinking something gets wrong (or even worse than it would be the case otherwise), not only in languages, but also in every other case...
that could be the reason, why I'm much better in subjects which simply have to be understood than in those where you have to learn^^
uhm, maybe it's so because I'm too lazy to learn anything

 

[Mobbelsche]

G'Day Folks!

I'm getting more and more impressed by the quality of grammar, vocabulary and style the people posting here actually possess! It's really a joy reading proper english here. I had already lost hope over the years and years of experiencing the creeping evolution of Denglisch and the like. But finally, oh joy, there is hope! Thanks so much

As far as the "dreaming-english"-thingie (pardon my french... that's a foible I learned from my former boss [french guy, actually ]) is concerned: While I was overseas I experienced some difficulties in using my school-english first. But after I finally had the guts to just try it got better and better until I had to realize that I was actually THINKING in english. That was the point when I started talking to myself in german just for the sake of hearing something familiar from time to time

And one final note: Lots of things in life tend to be mastered more easily when not thought over in the first place

Greets,
Mobbel

 

[drago]

Mobbelsche

I think it's very normal to think in english after using the language for some hours/days. But I'm concerned about your need to talk to yourself. Maybe that's what happened to yawgmoth

(see strategy OT if you don't know him )

I actually had MacGyver once talk Russian to me in a dream.

I don't know what scares me more: You dreaming of MacGyver or him speaking Russian.

 

[DerBK]

Dreaming in english ist very familiar to me. In fact i found myself thinking english a whole lot of times for a few years now.
English is just a superior language for everyday use in my opinion, not as clumsy as german is.

 

[Mobbelsche]

Mornin' ev'rybody *yawn*

Of course I know yawgmoth. I still recall the way he and some others rampaged through these forums trying to proselytise even the staunchest duper... It was quite funny to watch him and the posters' reactions
That was one of those typical examples of "Silence is golden"^^

Anyway, I don't know why you mention him in regard to my talking to myself. Will check the strat-OT now to understand

By the way: I was using the language for some two or three months before losing my "mothertongue-brain". And believe me: When you are abroad, do not have any chance to call home (expensive as hell), and all your life starts crushing before your eyes you'll feel extremely lost in some alien world. That was when I started talking to myself. I managed to get rid of this habit when I came back here, though^^
What I'm trying to say is that there are times when you really miss the familiar feeling of "home". If someone told me that before my own experience I wouldn't have believed it. In, say, 99% of my time I could not care less about germany, western culture, german habits, and german food. And I do not tend to get homesick either. But in this fairly extreme situation it was nice to eat a big steak, drink a beer, and listen to german words (I also listened to german music a lot).

Hmmm, I tend to be rather talkative when writing english. Great to have the opportunity of using the rusty ol' language again

Greets.
Mobbel

 

[TwinYawgmoth]

Hm, seems to me that I am talkative even when not using English.

Seems to me that you talk far too much rubbish.

Well, who has asked you, anyway?

I believe I wanted to clarify Mobbel's confusion regarding your talking with yourself.

I? With me? Who is the one who torments every single one of my Posts?

I am not in all of your Posts ...

In all of MY Posts you are, I just have the courtesy to leave YOUR Posts alone, bane of my existence!

Yawgmoth

 

[Mobbelsche]

Uuuh, the schizophrenic has arrived

I just wanted to defend german language a bit. I really came to love german. It's not the least bit clumsy. It's the people using the language that are clumsy. Look at american english. That's rudimentary usage of a wonderful language. It's the bare bones of the language, so to speak. The same is true for german. Most people just do not use the language to its extent, thus making it into a harsh sounding crap. If you compared language to tools (which is NOT all that a language actually is), most people would use it like a hammer while at least some are able to do, say, a clockmaker's work.

My 2 cent

 

[drago]

The main problem is, that most people just use the same tool for everything. You know: when your only tool is a hammer you tend to see every problem as a nail.

So even if somebody uses the clockmaker's tool, he has a problem if he doesn't know the other tools. Sometimes you just need a sledge hammer (no, not the guy in the tv series)

 

[Mobbelsche]

I totally agree with you That has to be something very archaic located somewhere in the brainstem. Hammering actually solves the initial problem most times, normally causing two or three follow-up problems in its wake. People tend to ignore that. And "ignorance" is the bestest term I can think of when talking about things like that^^

Greets,
Mobbel *nowdiggingforsomeTVSeries-DVDs*

P.S.: "bestest" was an intentional mistake

 

[DeLaDragon]

I actually had MacGyver once talk Russian to me in a dream.

Thanks for that, cheered me up on a crappy morning

On what was talked about earlier: German is a great language in some cases. Yet it's a very formal language. Being romantic in German means in most cases being corny, if not cheesy. As arrogant as it may sound, I'd say I'm pretty good with words. And still there are just some expressions where English just works better than German. Especially when you talk with someone about friendship

Anyway, gonna watch scrubs now

P.S. @ Mobbelsche

From a linguistic point, there's nothing wrong with reducing a language to its minimum. You might even see it as the better way. For example, "ghetto slang" is often called bad English. That might be true but on the other hand it's just a simplification and therefore also an improvement. It expresses the same as Oxford English or something similar, only in a much easier way. And if you want to answer with "but it sounds horrible", think about the way "Mich deucht, ich sah ein Englein schweben" sounds if used in everyday's language around here

 

[Mobbelsche]

I never would dare to answer that, DeLaDragon. It really doesn't matter how I personally perceive spoken words. Some might even like abbreviated or "slangy" language. I like to use it from time to time when chatting with aussie friends. Then I agree with you: Minimalistic language can be quite fine. But then it's just for the use in every day life. Anyway, it takes away a lot of the innate beauty of language itself (be it english or german or any other [maybe except french ]).

Maybe we should differenciate two different occasions: When using language as a tool of communication, simplification works fine and might even be considered as artful when done properly. On the other hand there's much more to it than just communication issues. It's about style, expression, sound, vocabulary, etc. That surely isn't useful in daily life but I still consider it as neccessary (at least for my own ears and/or eyes^^). Anyway, no need to argue here.

And yes, there's always times when one language is better suited then the other. Might spring from the social background that the language evolved from... That's the good thing of learning several languages: You can choose the proper one
Hmmm... at least as long as your partner is able to understand

Greets,
Mobbel


/edit : I think there's nothing wrong about being corny from time to time as long as you are not overly serious, Otherwise it will just be cheesy...

 

[Riven]

Hmm, all this discussion about the use of the languages made me think. For what do we actually still use our languages? I guess Mobbelsche is very good with his answer of the main causes for spoken and written words. But I would like to expand that idea a bit further. There is also a type of spoken language that is almost written. I mean songs, peoms and works of art that use the spoken variety. These use mainly words that are uncommon to our daily use, which consists of roughly 2000-3000 words, no more. Scary to think that the english language consits of more than 200000 words, and we only really use less than 2 percent of it for out normal lifes. But the reason for that is simply that we do not need flowery descriptions to order pizza or to discuss breakfast table topics.
The further we go down the economic and social ladder the worse this gets. Until we reach slang and only a abriged version of the language. Is does not really matter which culture we look at. When I see talkshows in Germany, listen to people who dropped out of Hauptschule, born in Germany and do not use more than a few hundred words to express their lifes... sometimes listening to those people make me want to throw up. But their is not much difference in the US. The further you go down, the less quality has the word. Its basic, its education. More complicated topics require more complicated choice of words and a complex syntax.


Different topic: Misture of languages. I really loved to talk to my aussie/british/american friends back in Berlin, who used to go to german/american highschool and mix both german and english according to neccessity. We used to discussing everything in Ginglish, taking what we required from each language to make our point. Many words just do not have the right translation to fit the needed expression in the other language.


its 6:40 in new York and I cannot get any sleep, please consider this while reading grammar and spellign and content. Brain is not working properly

 

[Mobbelsche]

its 6:40 in new York and I cannot get any sleep, please consider this while reading grammar and spellign and content. Brain is not working properly

I forgive you

Now, what you said about vocabulary made me think of times when I was old enough to read (and understand) George Orwell's 1984. That's the perfect example of people losing the ability to express themselves when one takes their vocabulary. Same with Mao's so called "cultural" revolution which left the people with a bare minimum of words, thus making it hard to even think about the concept of a free nation. The reduction of vocabulary by force is one of the main concepts in suppressing a people. Same goes with illiteracy etc.

Greets,
Mobbel

 

[DeLaDragon]

Sorry to cut in the highly interesting discussion (seriously, I love talking about language, again no irony, just to make that clear ^^) but I've got to tell this.

Remember how I told you that a dog chased me a short time ago? Same thing happened this time - but this time it was for about 3 kilometres with a flat tire. So finally I was lost, had no idea where I was heading but a pretty big dog chasing me - again, I'm just scared of dogs - so I did the best I could and cycled as fast as possible, somewhat around 35km/h. I couldn't return so I drove a rough circle through the forests and finally I managed to get to the place where the chase started. Now starts the fun: The owner was nowhere near. So guess what - I took the same way again and got to the dog owner who thought I was hiding on a tree or something. He got the dog on the leash and called me an idiot, his dog would exactly do what he told him to and never bite mite. So called me an idiot. So I'm like "yeah, I'm sorry but I'm afraid of dogs and quite frankly, your dog didn't come when you called him earlier." And that asshole goes: "You can be glad I don't sue you for the time I've lost due to that!"

So I shook my head and left..

 

[Mobbelsche]

Ever tried CS or pepperspray? Works pretty well on dogs when hitting them on their snout. At least that's what I heard... The downside might be that dogs that are already aggressive by character tend to go crazy on that^^ But this could also mean that they bite their owner. Would serve 'em right

I am a runner myself and have naturally the same problems with dogs. It may sound silly but the best thing you can do is stop. Giving the dog the opportunity to chase after you triggers hunting reflexes. Most dogs just run with you for the challenge and fun. You can see that when you look at their body language. In 99% of all cases they just run a bit, you slow down, they win, feel proud and stop chasing you. If you're extremely unlucky and get caught by an aggressive one...well, bad luck. You'd got caught even when running/cycling away. Speed doesn't matter^^ Then you can still sue the owner (And yes, you'd survive. Believe me^^)
That's still not meant as an excuse for the owner. He should accept that there are people out there afraid of dogs, and they should be responsible enough to react in favour of those people (and not of their loved four-legged feetwarmer). This implies that they actually have control over their pet which, I'm afraid, is not always the case. I'm still naive enough to believe in "educating dog-owners": When I run by a person who just lets his dog sit down while I pass or who grabs the neckband for just some seconds I always thank them. If they don't I ignore them or worse... I get along with all dogs in the surrounding areas by now^^

Greets,
Mobbel

/edit: And you shouldn't bother about this particularly stupid man. There's mostly idiots out there and that was just another perfect example^^